Mesmerise: the most useless of all trans skills?

Seftin

Just delete mesmerise, switch hypochondria and action aroubd. Gg, hf.

Blujixapug

Tael said:

Alternatively, getting any other sort of non-combat information-gathering tool would be neat, like, say, a way to hypnotise people to make them SAY their last few utterances or something similarly interesting (SUGGEST <target> SPEAK CT/HTS/HT/HNT/OT/SAY, treating their speaking/channel history as a stack with, say, ten max elements and having it pop off the next one for each SPEAK suggestion implanted within a single hypnosis (so implanting five and snapping then implanting five and snapping would reveal the same five each time)). Really, I don't think the class needs any more big (or even little really) combat things.

I think it's important for organisational channels to be fairly secure, otherwise people become reluctant to use them, and start holding conversations through messages. You want to avoid training people into bad behaviour.

But I think @Tael's idea is cool. And there exists quite a bit of counterplay for hypnosis. So if you were hypnotised and snapped, you could leave the room before you spoke any of the archived orgtells (although eavesdrop could somewhat counter that, which is fun). If you did start reciting org tells, you would be aware of precisely what information was leaked.

Another idea because why not. What if you could mesmerise someone into believing you were another person. It wouldn't necessarily be a hypnosis suggestion because then you'd have to snap to activate it which would defeat the point... Maybe you'd hypnotise Tvistor, then, I don't know, "mesmerise silas", and if the hypnosis was successful, for the next couple of minutes, Tvistor would view you as Silas in look/ql, and anything you said would be displayed to Tvistor as "Silas says...". Anyone not mesmerised would be unaffected of course. Taking damage would cancel the effect (but perhaps not other aggressive actions - like illusions). Imagine the possibilities: "Prove it's really you!" People would probably just send tells to verify a person was who they were, but that would still be fun.

Daeir

God damnit @Blujixapug, you really need to be a Celani.

Like, seriously. I don't think I've ever seen you post anything other than poignant wit and extremely good ideas. That is a fantastic idea, perhaps too fantastic.

Yue

Bad ideas so far:

1. Make mesmerize work like a chameleon tattoo
2. Delete mesmerize
3. Make mesmerize an ability that forces a person to say things they have said recently on various channels (this is MORE useful than what it does now?!?! No.)
4. Switch mesmerize and action around.

Good ideas so far:

1. Hmmmmm.

Daeir

@Yue: I think you should actually try playing your Serpent for a while before making grandiose suggestions about what is good and what is not for the class.

Xith

I think "disguise" abilities are long overdue.

Had the idea for a non-achaea shapeshifter class for which that sort of thing would be the staple. You could sneak into enemy cities past the denizen guards. And then when the real deal walks into the same room you have the whole "No, shoot him!" standoff. Imagine the hilarity.

And infiltration might not be something to hardcode back in. But more rp opportunities for misplaced keys, stolen passwords, etc.

Alternately, maybe an Infiltration miniskill or skill (that Subterfuge gives a bonus to), allowing everyone to sneak in places so it's not just "be on the alert for serpents".

Aepas

Daeir said:

@Yue: I think you should actually try playing your Serpent for a while before making grandiose suggestions about what is good and what is not for the class.

pot meet kettle.

Xith

Pot and kettle, meet squirtle.

Seftin

Make mesmerise a willpower drain ability that reduces the lock time for hypnosis/doesn't show message when fails and doesn't make you drop any defences like breathing etc so you can hypno someone without giving things away. Also make spamming the same suggestion not drain mana ><

Caladbolg

I've got it. Lower the time it takes to mesmerize someone down to 3 seconds, Can't do anything have it keep it's current effect and allow Mesmerize to include illusions in it as well.

In this idea we've got the old Mesmerize ability still in, reducing it down a bit to be useful and since Mesmerize doesn't give any messages at all once you've started it the chances of you getting hindered during are reduced down. however it still has a drawback so it doesn't completely take over hypnosis.

Allowing it to throw out illusions will help add into serpent affliction combat.

Daeir

That's alright, I guess. I personally prefer something with more flavour but less combat use, but that feels pretty valid. Could string off sileris curing illusions and other hindering ones while prepping hypnosis which would be mighty useful.

Tael

Xith said:

Alternately, maybe an Infiltration miniskill or skill (that Subterfuge gives a bonus to), allowing everyone to sneak in places so it's not just "be on the alert for serpents".

I would like to know why threads about, say, monks don't always have posts saying that the solution to the problem under discussion is to put in a general skill to make characters of all classes capable of fighting better unarmed.

Some sort of disguise ability, however would be great. Really, anything that would make serpents more sneaky would be neat. Phase is great, but everyone and their mother keeps thirdeye up all the time to see through cloak and the solution of just evading everywhere is tedious and boring, to say nothing of the automated tracking people do now (the other day I watched someone with a veil act as a radar dish, with a trigger to automatically locate requested people and respond with their location when sent a message in a certain format). It would be nice to have some tools to make intelligence-gathering a less passive experience: less idling hidden and cham'ed hoping no radar dishes are online and in the area and more disguises and unwitting informants.

@Caladbolg - I'm not really feeling it. I would still use hypno pretty much every time and would still only use mesmerise for the things I use it for right now. It's also a somewhat complex suggestion - "mesmerise is an ability where you can't do anything else but they can't see the hypnosis" is pretty simple and intuitive. If there's a problem with the skill, it's that mesmerise is higher than it should be, not a problem with mesmerise's actual functionality.

Daeir

Really? I'd use those first two illusions while mesmerising to probe out what they prioritize and what illusions have a chance of actually working on them. Unless they have lifevision, in which case I'd use that three seconds to find a place where I can bury myself since I'm probably going to lose this fight.

Tael

Daeir said:

Really? I'd use those first two illusions while mesmerising to probe out what they prioritize and what illusions have a chance of actually working on them. Unless they have lifevision, in which case I'd use that three seconds to find a place where I can bury myself since I'm probably going to lose this fight.

Stabbing them once or twice is usually more efficient at figuring out priorities than illusions in my experience, though I guess if you're suggesting that the illusion balance wouldn't conflict with the balance taken by implanting each suggestion, then I suppose that wouldn't be totally useless. Stabbing also has the benefit that, if you're fast and discover certain priorities, you can turn your test stabs into the beginning of an actual combo. But I've never really seen getting hypnosis in as a problem (edit: since the change to deal with running away anyway) - I always think of it as the most laid-back part since you don't have to preserve momentum or worry about them shielding and having to restart your hypnosis or anything.

Daeir

Still, seconds are seconds, and I tend to cherish every one since I have to work with a high latency and an unartied dirk. If I can test a priority with an illusion without slowing down my offense, I'm going to do it, hence why I like the idea.