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Is Achaea losing its "world"?

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  • AzramAzram Posts: 26Member
    edited October 2018
    I normally don't post, and I spend most of my time just lurking and reading when I log on. However, I remembered this topic, and I thought I'd share my opinion. Just for some background, I first started playing right around the time the last guild converted to a House. Since then, I've been playing off and on, and I managed to reach a couple of leadership positions in a House. I've hunted to around dragon level a couple of times, and I've also been a Guide before, but I've no extensive reputation or ability as a pker. I'd do some small scale combat/raiding, but I'm not going to act like I was really that good. With that out of the way, I'll provide my current outlook for Achaea over the last couple of years.

    For starters, I'll go with the things that I think Achaea has done right:

    -The trade skill split was a good idea. I feel like classes that lost their skills gained a bit of utility and identity other than being "the harvesting class that is melee/magic/etc based". It also allowed more individuals to take part in the crafting process and provide a dwindling population with levels of goods.
    -The large-scale events have been great. Bal'met, the Tsol'teth return, Slith, etc. Not much more to really say here other than they were amazing and well written.
    -The elimination of veils and the shrinking of off-plane areas was a big plus in my mind. While it might suck that some of the distant areas are losing their remote aspects, I feel like it's better for the game in general to have players more readily interacting with each other.
    -Stat pack arrival were amazing for actually making races more playable across the board.
    -Plenty of QoL improvements, such as the credit increase you get for leveling past 80, liquid rift, server side curing, no-brainer packages, etc. All of these make the game a lot more accessible and manageable on limited time or experience.
    -Decreasing the God count was a very good idea. Hopefully we get people playing the more pivotal god roles in the future, and we can have more active gods in general.

    Now, let's talk about where I feel the game has strayed off:

    -The forging system feels like complete and utter trash to me. I can understand the balancing problems that the old system created, but the new system just feels so lackluster. I don't even bother really looking at what I buy anymore, since there's no real differentiation other than purely cosmetic concerns outside a minor increase in stats. 
    -They failed to take advantage of the Alchemist introduction. There's really been nothing about the split over the curatives since the arrival. I feel like this was a huge wasted potential, and now it's the same with above. I just grab whatever is cheaper and don't really pay attention outside that.
    -Racial RP has always been a big pet peeve of mine. I've always felt that Achaea needed a more strong since of Racial RP, and the new stat pack system would have allowed that. Individuals wouldn't need to pick certain races just to use their class anymore, and the game could have gone with a stronger racial base. It's hard to do that however with artifacts that let you jump every day though.
    -The House Renaissance. I'm sorry, but I just feel this was a bad idea. I recognize that some Houses were in dire need of help or restructure, but the game lost way too much lore when this happened. I understand the idea was to have the new Houses build their own lore and establish themselves, but I personally feel this hasn't really happened in the last couple of years. Not to mention how long it took for Ashtan to even get their reset, which really hurt the population at the time. The new Houses feel extremely generic to me with very little differentiating them from each other on a per city basis. It's possible that I'm just not involved enough to understand the impact these are making, but that's just how I feel from an outsider looking in.
    -I feel like Gods are really just not visible like they used to be. Naturally this would decrease since there are fewer active divine than in the old days. However, I feel like outside of their Orders or appearing on QW the Gods just really don't have much presence. I rarely see them shouting, or doing things that interact with the playerbase as a whole.
    -Small scale events seem to have fallen by the wayside to me. I understand that it's difficult with the huge content spike from the opening of the Yggdrasil Tree. However, the game just feels dead outside the major events. While the smaller scale ones might not have added hugely to the world, it did make the background of the game feel more alive for me.
    -World Games...What happened? It seems like we almost never see foozles or egghunts and the like outside the huge celebrations. I've always really enjoyed the games, and it just saddens me at how rare they've become.
    -Promotional items: I've never been someone who was heavily anti-artifact. I understand that the game is a business and needs to generate money to keep the doors open. However, the shift towards things like caches and talisman sets over the last years has left a really bad taste in my mouth. It feels like the game is much more P2W now, and the aforementioned items like a mad cash grab from the playerbase. I'm not saying that these things are inherently bad. However, the rate at which they are pushed on us and new sets come out just sickens me.

    I'm sure there are other things that I've missed on both sides of my breakdown. However, my feeling about the direction that Achaea is taking likely isn't going to change. The game world just feels incredibly less interesting to me, and I have a hard time dedicating as much passion to it as I once did. Some of this is surely nostalgia for the old days and a bit of jaded outlook about the way the game is run. However, I feel the game is transitioning into more of a cookie-cutter promotional item based world. I can get that from tons of other games.
    AegothRangorAchimrst
  • KietKiet Posts: 3,103Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited October 2018
    House ren was 100% necessary with a shrinking population and too many houses. Even now, we probably have too many houses, but not having like 4-5 houses in each city lets houses actually have people online.

    That said, people should've had the guts to say 'no, this house isn't like the others, and it'll stay.' As is, we just deleted every house so it was 'fair', but houses like the occies being deleted were a huge blow.
    Sherazad
  • ShirszaeShirszae Santo DomingoPosts: 3,071Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Dunno. The House wipe had to be 100 or 0, I think. The moment someone was given the option to say no, everyone was going to say no because no one wanted to lose the House they were invested in. House ren might have been 100% necessary, but I believe it has handled 100% the wrong way too.

    And you won't understand the cause of your grief...


    ...But you'll always follow the voices beneath.

  • SobriquetSobriquet Posts: 2,178Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Cain said:
    Yes. Part of the reason I don't even play anymore but just spout political drunken nonsense is because the game took a giant step back. 

    The gods don't play anymore. The combat was made more "user friendly". The factions rarely have a reason to fight anymore. Anyone who can fight all migrate to Ashtan and the RP, is almost completely dead.

    The days of having Covenant and Tirloke swoop in to save me from the big bad Radagast and Andelas are gone. Replaced by shameless moneygrabs. Not only by Matt but the rest of the player base. All anyone pays attention to anymore is the credit market.

    The pinnacle of the game for me was Thoth and Matsuhama descending from their lofty thrones, dropping their fire and fighting me one on one. Dodging Aegis's axes in his own order hall and Gaia burning me down when I got too feisty. 

    Where has all the Gods gone? 


    You mean combat is more balanced and more accessible and you can't just 1 shot people anymore with the MasterCard?
    image
  • ProficyProficy Posts: 335Member ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    @Azram

    Great post, 100% agree with you on the forging part... its ALOT of time and money poured into forging... like a redic amount, for nothing more to be able to say you've done it... I mean every city maybe needs 1 active legend Smith for the embrasures, but even if they dont... its alot easier to pay someone like 50k for one than dump 10-12 mil into being able to do it yourself.

    Now I dont agree with you on the trade skill part, as those classes who were heavily invested into a specific trade, had a purpose then... forced a certain RP as well as more player interaction.... as it is now, I can do everything my damn self and tell everyone to buzz off. I mean now everyone is so PK intensive and balanced, there is no class rp anymore. I remember when a priest was just what it was supposed to be, a pacifist class with 100% support role, so those in that class could rp such with those ones and twos who wanted to try and be special.... or druids that were 100% useless out of there groves, but gods in them, they could rp to be those loners and what not... jus sayin everyone being able to do everything all equal like kills the rp and dynamics, imo
    AmeerJiraishin
  • CainCain Posts: 108Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Sobriquet said:
    Cain said:
    Yes. Part of the reason I don't even play anymore but just spout political drunken nonsense is because the game took a giant step back. 

    The gods don't play anymore. The combat was made more "user friendly". The factions rarely have a reason to fight anymore. Anyone who can fight all migrate to Ashtan and the RP, is almost completely dead.

    The days of having Covenant and Tirloke swoop in to save me from the big bad Radagast and Andelas are gone. Replaced by shameless moneygrabs. Not only by Matt but the rest of the player base. All anyone pays attention to anymore is the credit market.

    The pinnacle of the game for me was Thoth and Matsuhama descending from their lofty thrones, dropping their fire and fighting me one on one. Dodging Aegis's axes in his own order hall and Gaia burning me down when I got too feisty. 

    Where has all the Gods gone? 


    You mean combat is more balanced and more accessible and you can't just 1 shot people anymore with the MasterCard?
    Yes
    SobriquetSeleucus
  • KietKiet Posts: 3,103Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Shirszae said:
    Dunno. The House wipe had to be 100 or 0, I think. The moment someone was given the option to say no, everyone was going to say no because no one wanted to lose the House they were invested in. House ren might have been 100% necessary, but I believe it has handled 100% the wrong way too.
    The individual Houses were not the ones that decided, the cities were. Cities should've had the spine and foresight to realize that some Houses were simply much harder to replace than others, but instead we ended up with everyone trying to play 'fair.' Of course, that's easier said than done, since people are incapable of putting away their biases. Overall, though, I believe we all know the mojushai and the occultists were on entirely different tiers of 'relevant to achaean lore.'
  • CainCain Posts: 108Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    They need to go back to guilds. I remember joining the OCCs and had to study harder than my political science final in college and give it to Shakti as an application and hard ass test questions.

    Bring back Guilds mfers
    Torinn
  • ShirszaeShirszae Santo DomingoPosts: 3,071Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited October 2018
    Kiet said:
    Shirszae said:
    Dunno. The House wipe had to be 100 or 0, I think. The moment someone was given the option to say no, everyone was going to say no because no one wanted to lose the House they were invested in. House ren might have been 100% necessary, but I believe it has handled 100% the wrong way too.
    The individual Houses were not the ones that decided, the cities were. Cities should've had the spine and foresight to realize that some Houses were simply much harder to replace than others, but instead we ended up with everyone trying to play 'fair.' Of course, that's easier said than done, since people are incapable of putting away their biases. Overall, though, I believe we all know the mojushai and the occultists were on entirely different tiers of 'relevant to achaean lore.'
    It still amounts to the same. It was either 100 or 0. Every House was relevant to the people in it. Just becaue it didnt met your relevancy criteria doesnt mean theirs was any less valid. The moment a city decided to keep an old House and other cities were forced to do away with theirs, it'd have been mayhem.

    Overall, having an excess of interesting Houses seems like a better deal than having just enough equally uninteresting ones.

    And you won't understand the cause of your grief...


    ...But you'll always follow the voices beneath.

    Erwin
  • KietKiet Posts: 3,103Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited October 2018
    Shirszae said:
    Kiet said:
    Shirszae said:
    Dunno. The House wipe had to be 100 or 0, I think. The moment someone was given the option to say no, everyone was going to say no because no one wanted to lose the House they were invested in. House ren might have been 100% necessary, but I believe it has handled 100% the wrong way too.
    The individual Houses were not the ones that decided, the cities were. Cities should've had the spine and foresight to realize that some Houses were simply much harder to replace than others, but instead we ended up with everyone trying to play 'fair.' Of course, that's easier said than done, since people are incapable of putting away their biases. Overall, though, I believe we all know the mojushai and the occultists were on entirely different tiers of 'relevant to achaean lore.'
    It still amounts to the same. It was either 100 or 0. Every House was relevant to the people in it. Just becaue it didnt met your relevancy criteria doesnt mean theirs was any less valid. The moment a city decided to keep an old House and other cities were forced to do away with theirs, it'd have been mayhem.

    Overall, having an excess of interesting Houses seems like a better deal than having just enough equally uninteresting ones.
    I don't subscribe to that at all. Not every house was relevant from a wider viewpoint. People's individual attachment does not correlate to the actual impact and importance an organization has/had.

    Also, iirc from people in leadership telling me their experience, no city was 'forced' to do away with all of theirs, it was 100% their choice and they just all chose the same thing. Of course, I could be wrong here, but I'd still say that was the wrong approach in the end whether it was the players or the admin deciding it.

    Another issue, of course, is that it was so spread out that some cities ended up with hindsight as an advantage but also varying degrees of limbo for a while. I doubt Targ would've picked 3 houses if they had a year to watch the other cities first, for instance.
    Taleila
  • TorinnTorinn Posts: 1,032Member ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    Cain said:
    They need to go back to guilds. I remember joining the OCCs and had to study harder than my political science final in college and give it to Shakti as an application and hard ass test questions.

    Bring back Guilds mfers
    I was never around for that and even I miss it.  It feels to me that everything is homogenized ezmode.  There really isn't much unique identity.
    Deucalion says, "Torinn is quite nice."
  • ShirszaeShirszae Santo DomingoPosts: 3,071Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Is easy to miss something horrible when you only have the rose-tinted nostalgia of other people to go by

    And you won't understand the cause of your grief...


    ...But you'll always follow the voices beneath.

    Melodie
  • TorinnTorinn Posts: 1,032Member ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    Pretty sure I would have liked it.  I love hard core in depth rp.  IC essays and research?  Yes please.
    Deucalion says, "Torinn is quite nice."
  • DevranDevran Posts: 595Member ✭✭✭✭ - Eminent
    Torinn said:
    Pretty sure I would have liked it.  I love hard core in depth rp.  IC essays and research?  Yes please.
    I liked it. Liked it in Imperian too back before Profession system was in.

    @Shirszae It's extremely shortsighted and very rude to tell people that their opinions about something from the past is only positive because of 'rose-tinted goggles'. I fully accept that you may have hated the Guild system. I respect that opinion and will fight for your right to have that opinion. (assuming that is your opinion here, using it as an example) But I will -not- accept anyone telling me that my opinion is not true and only the wistful remembrance of days gone by. I know what I enjoyed and I enjoyed the Guild system much more than Houses/Professions in both games. I also understand that you may not have been saying those things, I'm more making a comment about the nature of the whole 'rose tinted' argument than anything you personally said.

    I would much prefer classes tied to guilds, the old forging system and other things from the past that are no longer present within Achaea. I doubt they'll return now, but if there was a way to get them back, I would definitely vote with my wallet and endorse them.
  • TorinnTorinn Posts: 1,032Member ✭✭✭✭✭ - Grand Achaean
    Nothing is, no.  It just means less now and is treated like "wow that dude is nutso".
    Deucalion says, "Torinn is quite nice."
  • KietKiet Posts: 3,103Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited October 2018
    Torinn said:
    Nothing is, no.  It just means less now and is treated like "wow that dude is nutso".
    no it's not. lol. I had several of my proteges and other younger housemembers write essays and research reports for their house advancement, the difference is these were optional ways to advance. older members do them too. some of them got favoured for them if they turned out particularly noteworthy.
    ShirszaeKyrraMelodieSherazad
  • FarrahFarrah Posts: 2,103Member, Secret Squirrel @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Kiet said:
    Shirszae said:
    Kiet said:
    Shirszae said:
    Dunno. The House wipe had to be 100 or 0, I think. The moment someone was given the option to say no, everyone was going to say no because no one wanted to lose the House they were invested in. House ren might have been 100% necessary, but I believe it has handled 100% the wrong way too.
    The individual Houses were not the ones that decided, the cities were. Cities should've had the spine and foresight to realize that some Houses were simply much harder to replace than others, but instead we ended up with everyone trying to play 'fair.' Of course, that's easier said than done, since people are incapable of putting away their biases. Overall, though, I believe we all know the mojushai and the occultists were on entirely different tiers of 'relevant to achaean lore.'
    It still amounts to the same. It was either 100 or 0. Every House was relevant to the people in it. Just becaue it didnt met your relevancy criteria doesnt mean theirs was any less valid. The moment a city decided to keep an old House and other cities were forced to do away with theirs, it'd have been mayhem.

    Overall, having an excess of interesting Houses seems like a better deal than having just enough equally uninteresting ones.
    I don't subscribe to that at all. Not every house was relevant from a wider viewpoint. People's individual attachment does not correlate to the actual impact and importance an organization has/had.

    Also, iirc from people in leadership telling me their experience, no city was 'forced' to do away with all of theirs, it was 100% their choice and they just all chose the same thing. Of course, I could be wrong here, but I'd still say that was the wrong approach in the end whether it was the players or the admin deciding it.

    Another issue, of course, is that it was so spread out that some cities ended up with hindsight as an advantage but also varying degrees of limbo for a while. I doubt Targ would've picked 3 houses if they had a year to watch the other cities first, for instance.


    I'd be really surprised if leaders had a choice to keep old Houses. The whole idea was to make all Houses accept all classes to facilitate multiclass. I think the Houses had to all change at least quite a bit. You could probably model a new House off of an old one somewhat if desired, but I don't think you could just keep it.

    I wish some things didn't seem just "lost" lore-wise, though. Like, House news just vanishing. House libraries. House clans (I assume?). It'd be nice, using the Occultist example, for example, if, say, the Savants were seen as a sort of evolution of the Occultists and had access to all the background knowledge and lore to build off of. Maybe they do - I haven't been in post-renaissance Ashtan. But I assume a lot was lost in the transition.

    Same with any other cities and Houses, though, really. It'd be nice if people could access archives of the old Houses. So much history. :(

    I think it's really difficult for Houses to find their place now. I don't think it's so much the House tasks, or the guild change, but just the fact that class gave Houses an inherent identity that is hard to replace with other things.

    TorinnKrizalKietSiduri
  • PenwizePenwize Posts: 1,424Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Farrah said:

    I think it's really difficult for Houses to find their place now. I don't think it's so much the House tasks, or the guild change, but just the fact that class gave Houses an inherent identity that is hard to replace with other things.

    You know, I don't actually think the problem is with inherent identity.  I think the problem stems from lack of goals. Right now, houses each have a sort of nebulous, over-arching goal they're trying to reach, but they're all wholly superseded by the goals of the faction/city. Houses are small enough now that house events are kind of a poor investment of admin time, so I feel like we just don't get any.  Ashtan has three gods and no house has had an individual house event (that I've seen).  Even if they did, I don't even know what that house event would entail.  There's barely any history to draw from, or individual house NPCs to interact with, and since the houses' inception there's barely any real role the houses have actually filled that random qualified people in the city wouldn't already be filling. The houses may as well just not exist.

    I felt the same way with Eleusis, the new houses had absolutely no teeth so you just picked which one had the clique of people you wanted to associate with, or the flavour of advancement you wanted, but they didn't actually affect what you'd be doing on a day to day basis in the game.

    Old houses, conversely, absolutely did affect how you played in a big way.
    TaryiusTorinnJiraishin
  • CailinCailin Posts: 224Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    I'm fairly new, so I'm not sure how the houses compare to the old guilds, or what they need. But... I've never really cared much about my house. That sounds sort of harsh and I don't mean it that way. It's a good house. But I mean if tomorrow they said "we're going to combine the two houses and everyone is just going to be Eleusian", I'd be like, "sure, whatever".

    My character has always mainly just identified as Eleusian. Like when people want me do to house-specific rituals I'm always like, "but why not the whole village?" Idk. There are some RP differences between the two houses, and stuff, but I think perhaps one of the main things they lack is a rich history. You can hear old folks go on and on about what they did in such and such guild back in the day. And they're filled with pride. Maybe one day we'll have that, but to have an interesting history, a house would have to have some importance beyond being a box to put people in. Like roles in events and stuff.

    But I'm not sure if houses could ever have that, because perhaps class based RP (while there were drawbacks) was a very rich and natural way to have an identity and meaning.

    ....Sorry just rambling about stuff I don't even know much about
    Rom
  • DupreDupre M.Posts: 231Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    ironically Cyrene ended up with the strongest House distinctions, between the Shield, the artsy farts, and the...leftovers one.
    https://www.achaea.com/banner/caiges.jpg
    Erwin
  • JiraishinJiraishin trapped in a thawing block of icePosts: 1,420Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    This is probably not a popular opinion, but I really miss class restrictions on Houses. It focused House RP and helped novices integrate into the House as they relied on older House members to learn the ins and outs of a class.
    ________________________
    The soul of Ashmond says, "Always with the sniping."
    TaleilaTorinn
  • TelinusTelinus Posts: 231Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished
    Guilds made me think of strong factions within a larger grouping.

    Houses make me think of somewhere I can go to learn from a tutor.

    I miss hanging out in a Guild, it had some cultural relevance and you felt part of something. Houses are just a requirement to be part of a city/gain a tutor.
  • ChissaChissa Posts: 12Member ✭✭ - Stalwart
    I don't think the problem is so much the houses but the fact that labels that these houses attach on a character are blank. Being a member of a certain house means nothing. The houses could disappear overnight and your character would still be perceived the same way as before.
    CailinTorinn
  • SherazadSherazad Planef UrthPosts: 956Member @ - Epic Achaean
    It's a work in progress but it starts with founders cementing house identity. I think Mhaldor did good with its two houses but that's more through leadership building onto the foundation and making sure members know -and- appreciate what makes each house distinct. The bright side is you are living and making the house history that will be talked about by future members. 
    Bleh, work ate my gaming life.
    내가 제일 잘 나가!!!111!!1


    KietQimaileh
  • KietKiet Posts: 3,103Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited October 2018
    Farrah said:
    Kiet said:
    Shirszae said:
    Kiet said:
    Shirszae said:
    Dunno. The House wipe had to be 100 or 0, I think. The moment someone was given the option to say no, everyone was going to say no because no one wanted to lose the House they were invested in. House ren might have been 100% necessary, but I believe it has handled 100% the wrong way too.
    The individual Houses were not the ones that decided, the cities were. Cities should've had the spine and foresight to realize that some Houses were simply much harder to replace than others, but instead we ended up with everyone trying to play 'fair.' Of course, that's easier said than done, since people are incapable of putting away their biases. Overall, though, I believe we all know the mojushai and the occultists were on entirely different tiers of 'relevant to achaean lore.'
    It still amounts to the same. It was either 100 or 0. Every House was relevant to the people in it. Just becaue it didnt met your relevancy criteria doesnt mean theirs was any less valid. The moment a city decided to keep an old House and other cities were forced to do away with theirs, it'd have been mayhem.

    Overall, having an excess of interesting Houses seems like a better deal than having just enough equally uninteresting ones.
    I don't subscribe to that at all. Not every house was relevant from a wider viewpoint. People's individual attachment does not correlate to the actual impact and importance an organization has/had.

    Also, iirc from people in leadership telling me their experience, no city was 'forced' to do away with all of theirs, it was 100% their choice and they just all chose the same thing. Of course, I could be wrong here, but I'd still say that was the wrong approach in the end whether it was the players or the admin deciding it.

    Another issue, of course, is that it was so spread out that some cities ended up with hindsight as an advantage but also varying degrees of limbo for a while. I doubt Targ would've picked 3 houses if they had a year to watch the other cities first, for instance.


    I'd be really surprised if leaders had a choice to keep old Houses. The whole idea was to make all Houses accept all classes to facilitate multiclass. I think the Houses had to all change at least quite a bit. You could probably model a new House off of an old one somewhat if desired, but I don't think you could just keep it.

    I wish some things didn't seem just "lost" lore-wise, though. Like, House news just vanishing. House libraries. House clans (I assume?). It'd be nice, using the Occultist example, for example, if, say, the Savants were seen as a sort of evolution of the Occultists and had access to all the background knowledge and lore to build off of. Maybe they do - I haven't been in post-renaissance Ashtan. But I assume a lot was lost in the transition.

    Same with any other cities and Houses, though, really. It'd be nice if people could access archives of the old Houses. So much history. :(

    I think it's really difficult for Houses to find their place now. I don't think it's so much the House tasks, or the guild change, but just the fact that class gave Houses an inherent identity that is hard to replace with other things.

    Yeah fair enough. My info is based on sketchy memories mostly, so I could def be wrong like I said. You're right that at least having the savants etc being 'officially' a successor would've been ideal, though.
    That said, some stuff was kept. Occy library got backed up (unfortunately one of the backups retired in a leadership position lol), for instance, but imo they should've gotten to keep a lot more than just the books in that case, at least. I agree with you that some stuff just  disappearing was a pita. However, Mhaldor also has gotten some of the stuff from the old Houses back, so I believe it's possible to do at least some kind of conservation.

    Re: houses not having identity, I believe that's 100% on the players. If your house has no events, that's because your leadership runs none. I was in several guilds back in the day and the proportion of divine-run events were tiny even back then.
    Even then, we have gotten divine run events that involved our houses, and that's something I'm infinitely grateful to Sartan for. We've had city-wide things that gave separate goals to both our houses, and both our house tutors interact with us regularly. We've also added a lot of stuff to our estates and consolidated our house identities further and, while that was pushed by Sartan, it was also largely player-run in the end.
    The problem with a lot of the new houses is often that the players just sort of gave up before they started. You need at least a few people that are passionate about the house to develop it.It's not like we didn't have these issues in Mhaldor of course, but we were lucky that we got some people that really pushed through and cared about the Legates and Insidium beyond 'lol I guess I have a different channel now.'
    Because the old guilds/houses had been there 'forever', people just kind of expected them to be X and wanted to have this history and identity handed to them. Which is, of course, what most people will always do. But the new houses are new for a reason, and you have to realize that it's up to you to make them something unique.
    I can't speak for all other houses, of course, but the Insidium has a ton of characters that are uniquely Insidium. If they tried to join the other house it'd be a wtf moment for whoever knows them. That's the goal to aspire to, in the end, to have characters whose house is an extension of their personality in some way.
    I don't mean to pick on anyone, but Torinn earlier saying for instance that if you wrote essays or did research you'd be mocked as an ex-leader of a house that should (in my understanding of the house, at least) be doing that kind of stuff is something that strikes me as odd and part of the issue. You have the power to make these things part of your house!
    Sartan
  • KlendathuKlendathu Eye of the StormPosts: 3,131Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Chissa said:
    I don't think the problem is so much the houses but the fact that labels that these houses attach on a character are blank. Being a member of a certain house means nothing. The houses could disappear overnight and your character would still be perceived the same way as before.
    That may be true of your house, but it's not true of all. I know I work very hard to establish and maintain a distinct identity for the Esoteric Consortium, as do the leaders of the other Ashtani houses.

    Tharos, the Announcer of Delos shouts, "It's near the end of the egghunt and I still haven't figured out how to pronounce Clean-dat-hoo."
    KyrraUtianima
  • PenwizePenwize Posts: 1,424Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Klendathu said:
    as do the leaders of the other Ashtani houses.
    Do they, though?
  • RangorRangor Posts: 3,180Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Scion for life! gooooo Scions!
    image
    RomUtianimaJahrak
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