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Serpent Questions.

ExelethrilExelethril moar theta decayPosts: 3,123Member @@ - Legendary Achaean

I have a few questions in regards to the serpent class. (Assuming I have 1.5k credits to spare)

  1. How viable is serpent bashing if I maximize Dex? (low hp)
  2. How "strong" is serpent bashing? Like, do I need a good whip, etc.
  3. Will a level 2 dirk suffice for combat or should I get a level 3?
  4. Should I maximize Dex? When do diminishing returns kick in?

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Comments

  • DalranDalran Posts: 227Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished

    Well, no clue about bashing, but you don't need an artie dirk at all to fight as a serpent, just assuming you max dexterity. The artie dirks just allow you to build some more constitution, instead of straight dex. Being as you can reach the dstab cap without an artied dirk with full dex spec.

    Exelethril
  • ExelethrilExelethril moar theta decayPosts: 3,123Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Neat, thanks for the answers. What level of dex does dstab speed cap out at with a level 2 dirk(12-13?) I could probably buy a level 3 if it's more efficient, tanking-wise.


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  • SiduriSiduri Posts: 1,437Member @ - Epic Achaean

    I have a level 2 dirk and 15 dex, not capped yet. My guess would be 16.


    image
  • SenaSena Posts: 3,849Member @@ - Legendary Achaean

    Dstab speed is base 2.8s (before nimble), reduced by 0.1s for each point of dex over 13, and reduced by 0.2s per level for artefact dirks. The speed cap is 2.1s, or 2s with a level 3 dirk.

    So for max dstab speed you need a L3 dirk and 15 dex, and without a L3 dirk you'll reach the cap at 20 dex with a normal dirk, 18 dex with L1, 16 dex with L2.

    The higher cap with a L3 dirk additionally means that you're only saving one point of dexterity (cap of 15 instead of 16) compared to L2, so that 1 extra point of con it allows isn't a giant tanking bonus, and you'll want more than 15 dex anyways if you want to maximise PvE as well (I don't know what the cap is for garrote, if any, but it's at least 17).

    ZamoraExelethrilReyf
  • ExelethrilExelethril moar theta decayPosts: 3,123Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Why do level 1 Dex boots have to be called "Pixie boots" :(


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  • DaslinDaslin The place with the oxygenPosts: 2,492Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Because only pixies don't wear shirts.

    AlcinaeChiam
  • SuladanSuladan Posts: 180Member

    @Sena‌ Any closer on a garrote speed formula? Trying to figure out if L3 Lash is still better than L3 Whip - in terms of DPS.

    The Truths hurt. Always.
  • SenaSena Posts: 3,849Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited August 2014

    I still don't know all the details of how dex affects speed, but the effects of the speed stat are the same as before. L3 lash is about 20% higher DPS than L3 whip, at 12 dex and ignoring accuracy. Dex should affect them both equally (slower garrotes get more benefit from dex, but the L3 whip shouldn't be slow enough for that), so the lash should always be about 20% higher DPS at any dex, but I can't be entirely certain of that.

    ExelethrilSuladanReyfValaria
  • AntoniusAntonius Posts: 4,242Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Why do level 1 Dex boots have to be called "Pixie boots" :(

    Customisation is only 50 credits!

  • ReyfReyf Posts: 3Member

    Really helpful info here, thanks guys for the contributions.  I'm noticing my home city (Cyrene) seems lacking in serpenty stuff (whips, scalemail) so I went to Hashan and found some decent stuff, anywhere else you guys might suggest for picking that kind of stuff up?

  • SenaSena Posts: 3,849Member @@ - Legendary Achaean

    Ashtan had some good whips for low prices last time I checked. I haven't looked for scalemail in a while, but Ashtan is probably good for that too.

    ReyfIsaiah
  • AerekAerek East Tennessee, USAPosts: 1,813Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Sena said:

    Dstab speed is base 2.8s (before nimble), reduced by 0.1s for each point of dex over 13, and reduced by 0.2s per level for artefact dirks. The speed cap is 2.1s, or 2s with a level 3 dirk.

    So for max dstab speed you need a L3 dirk and 15 dex, and without a L3 dirk you'll reach the cap at 20 dex with a normal dirk, 18 dex with L1, 16 dex with L2.

    The higher cap with a L3 dirk additionally means that you're only saving one point of dexterity (cap of 15 instead of 16) compared to L2, so that 1 extra point of con it allows isn't a giant tanking bonus, and you'll want more than 15 dex anyways if you want to maximise PvE as well (I don't know what the cap is for garrote, if any, but it's at least 17).

    Do we know how dirk speed factors in? Announce 3953 last October said it did, but I've tried testing with several serpents, and the numbers never seem to add up.

    -- Grounded in but one perspective, what we perceive is an exaggeration of the truth.
  • SenaSena Posts: 3,849Member @@ - Legendary Achaean

    That was just a mistake in the announce post, Makarios confirmed that dirk speed doesn't matter at all for dstab.

    Praxides
  • AerekAerek East Tennessee, USAPosts: 1,813Member @@ - Legendary Achaean

    That doesn't make sense to me, either. These are just a few numbers from just a few minutes ago, from a Trans Subterfuge Serpent with 12 DEX and Nimble:

    164 speed:  3.2, 3.4, 3.2

    174 speed:  3.9, 3.4

    186 speed:  3.4, 3.2

    196 speed:  3.1, 3.2, 3.1

    206 speed: 2.7, 2.8, 3.2

    214 speed: 2.9, 2.9, 2.9

    Everything I've seen and read says base speed should be 2.8 and goes up from there, but several Serpent midbies I've tested with have clocked in slower than 3, and they can't all be lying/lagging/unable to read timestamps.

    There was a significant boost the moment I handed him a dirk with speed over 200, but it still came in slower than he should be, since he does have Nimble. If Dstab's base is 2.8, shouldn't he be clocking in at 2.6 or so?

    Granted, all of this is coming from second-hand sources, as I can't test with my own eyes, but the results are relatively consistent across the Serpents I test with, so I'm just thoroughly confused.

    -- Grounded in but one perspective, what we perceive is an exaggeration of the truth.
    Praxides
  • JovoloJovolo EnglandPosts: 3,120Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    I tested doublestab a week ago with server queue and found the numbers (from multiple perspectives) varied greatly from one stab to the next. By the end, as a level 0 dirk, 16 dex serpent, I went from 2.1 to 2.5 over the course of 20 stabs. Something looks to be suspect about it.

    Praxides
  • AerekAerek East Tennessee, USAPosts: 1,813Member @@ - Legendary Achaean

    Makarios did confirm for me that dirk speed doesn't matter. I don't know why he magically got faster once I gave him the 200+ dirk, but it was a pretty confusing coincidence.

    -- Grounded in but one perspective, what we perceive is an exaggeration of the truth.
    Praxides
  • MicosituMicositu Posts: 31Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5819m (100%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:23.010 (+61m, 1.0%) 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (2.189s)

    5980h (100%h), 5786m (99%m), 99%e, 84%w excdbk 46.4- 16:33:25.198 

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5776m (99%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:25.369 (-10m, 0.2%) 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (1.669s)

    5980h (100%h), 5776m (99%m), 100%e, 84%w excdbk 46.4- 16:33:27.038 

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5776m (99%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:27.205 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (1.653s)

    5980h (100%h), 5743m (98%m), 99%e, 84%w excdbk 46.4- 16:33:28.858 

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5743m (98%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:29.036 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (1.608s)

    5980h (100%h), 5743m (98%m), 100%e, 84%w excdbk 46.4- 16:33:30.645 

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5743m (98%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:30.815 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (1.619s)

    5980h (100%h), 5721m (98%m), 99%e, 84%w excdbk 46.4- 16:33:32.433 

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5721m (98%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:32.598 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (1.616s)

    5980h (100%h), 5809m (99%m), 100%e, 84%w excdbk 46.4- 16:33:34.213 

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5809m (99%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:34.378 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (1.589s)

    5980h (100%h), 5786m (99%m), 99%e, 84%w excdbk 46.4- 16:33:35.967 

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5786m (99%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:36.095 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (1.794s)

    5980h (100%h), 5786m (99%m), 100%e, 84%w excdbk 46.4- 16:33:37.889 

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5786m (99%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:38.006 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (1.937s)

    5980h (100%h), 5776m (99%m), 99%e, 84%w excdbk 46.4- 16:33:39.944 

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5755m (98%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:40.066 (-21m, 0.4%) 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (1.674s)

    5980h (100%h), 5745m (98%m), 100%e, 84%w excdbk 46.4- 16:33:41.741 

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5745m (98%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:41.915 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (1.662s)

    5980h (100%h), 5809m (99%m), 99%e, 84%w excdbk 46.4- 16:33:43.576 

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5809m (99%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:43.711 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (1.751s)

    5980h (100%h), 5787m (99%m), 99%e, 84%w excdbk 46.4- 16:33:45.463 

    You prick Mycen twice in rapid succession with your dirk.

    5980h (100%h), 5787m (99%m), 99%e, 84%w ecdbk 46.4- 16:33:45.631 

    You have recovered balance on all limbs. (1.563s)


    Level 3, 17 dex.

  • HanleyHanley Posts: 188Member ✭✭✭ - Distinguished

    @Exelthril 16 dex + level 2 dirk

    I went on a stabbing spree and these are the fastest and slowest my dstab speed was: (1.9s) and (1.758s)

    Not to sure if it helps you any at all with your question, but at least its something I suppose.

    - 2014/05/13 03:37:22 - Jhui dies gasping for breath, asphyxiated by the power of Hanley Silverstorm's kai.


    SerpentKai Go!

  • AktillumAktillum PhilippinesPosts: 1,365Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    edited September 2014
    Little confused - Is 17 Dex and a level 1 dirk preferable to 16 Dex and a level 2? Are you still hitting the speed cap, or missing it by .1ms?

  • SenaSena Posts: 3,849Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Each dirk level is 0.2s, each point of dexterity is 0.1s. 16 dex and L2 dirk is at the cap, 17 dex and L1 dirk is slower (0.1s away from the cap)
    Aktillum
  • EldEld Posts: 3,946Member @@ - Legendary Achaean
    Why do level 1 Dex boots have to be called "Pixie boots" :(

    Pixie boots are totally metal.
    [spoiler]
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